Japanese 1.3L Engines
#1
Japanese 1.3L Engines
I heard SOMEWHERE (can't remember where exactly) that the Japanese Honda Jazz has a 1.3L engine compared to our 1.5L engines.
A few questions:
1) Does anyone know if this is true?
2) If so, would it be a direct swap to the USDM Honda Fits?
I imagine that there would need to be a new ECU as well due to the fuel maps being different.
The same question is presented about the transmission. Does the JDM transmission have longer gears?
As you can imagine, I'm a Fuel Economy nut. A 1.3L engine would totally rock in this car.
A few questions:
1) Does anyone know if this is true?
2) If so, would it be a direct swap to the USDM Honda Fits?
I imagine that there would need to be a new ECU as well due to the fuel maps being different.
The same question is presented about the transmission. Does the JDM transmission have longer gears?
As you can imagine, I'm a Fuel Economy nut. A 1.3L engine would totally rock in this car.
#2
If you are a fuel economy nut, then this doesn't make good sense.
Let's say that you can get an engine, tranny, and ECU for $2500...
If you are currently getting 30 mpg, and you could get 40 mpg with the new setup. If gasoline is running $2.50 a gallon, then it would take you 120,000 miles to recover that investment.
Assuming that there are no issues with the engine (which a USDM one would be under warranty for a while...) I can't understand why you would want to do this.
FWIW - the 1.3L is a DSI engine instead of a VTEC.
Let's say that you can get an engine, tranny, and ECU for $2500...
If you are currently getting 30 mpg, and you could get 40 mpg with the new setup. If gasoline is running $2.50 a gallon, then it would take you 120,000 miles to recover that investment.
Assuming that there are no issues with the engine (which a USDM one would be under warranty for a while...) I can't understand why you would want to do this.
FWIW - the 1.3L is a DSI engine instead of a VTEC.
#3
Originally Posted by wyy183
If you are a fuel economy nut, then this doesn't make good sense.
Let's say that you can get an engine, tranny, and ECU for $2500...
If you are currently getting 30 mpg, and you could get 40 mpg with the new setup. If gasoline is running $2.50 a gallon, then it would take you 120,000 miles to recover that investment.
Assuming that there are no issues with the engine (which a USDM one would be under warranty for a while...) I can't understand why you would want to do this.
FWIW - the 1.3L is a DSI engine instead of a VTEC.
Let's say that you can get an engine, tranny, and ECU for $2500...
If you are currently getting 30 mpg, and you could get 40 mpg with the new setup. If gasoline is running $2.50 a gallon, then it would take you 120,000 miles to recover that investment.
Assuming that there are no issues with the engine (which a USDM one would be under warranty for a while...) I can't understand why you would want to do this.
FWIW - the 1.3L is a DSI engine instead of a VTEC.
People swap in giant K-series powerhouses into their little hondas all of the time and no one ever points out to them that they'll never make their money back. People want more power so they do whatever it takes to get it. I, on the other end of the spectrum, want better fuel economy, so I do whatever it takes to get it.
Now, back to my questions. Do you have answers to them?
#6
Originally Posted by kentris
Er....I have i-DSi and it isn't a diesel.
Afaik, there isn't a Jazz/Fit diesel.
Afaik, there isn't a Jazz/Fit diesel.
i-DSi = intelligent Dual and Sequential Ignition. It has two spark plugs per cylinder, and only two valves per cylinder.
Does anyone know if the i-DSi is a direct swap into the VTi or VTi-S frame?
#7
Originally Posted by Mateo
I never said I was in it to save money. You're right though, the cost of the engine swap would take a long time to recoup. That doesn't mean that I don't want to do it.
People swap in giant K-series powerhouses into their little hondas all of the time and no one ever points out to them that they'll never make their money back. People want more power so they do whatever it takes to get it. I, on the other end of the spectrum, want better fuel economy, so I do whatever it takes to get it.
Now, back to my questions. Do you have answers to them?
People swap in giant K-series powerhouses into their little hondas all of the time and no one ever points out to them that they'll never make their money back. People want more power so they do whatever it takes to get it. I, on the other end of the spectrum, want better fuel economy, so I do whatever it takes to get it.
Now, back to my questions. Do you have answers to them?
#8
Originally Posted by Ricepuddin
Um yes they do.... all the time. But when you put a K20 in a little car you get bonner inspiring power to weight and some decent time slips. With the 1.3L you'll get the satisfaction of pissing on OPEC.
If you guys havn't seen from my signature, I run a forum for fuel economy enthusiasts. Fuel economy is a hobby of mine. I kind of like being able to say "I get 60MPG in my old civic" or something like that.
A guy on my site achieved over 70MPG in his old Del Sol, which I'm still baffled by.
I recently swaped a d15z1 engine (From a Civic VX) into my 1989 Civic LX. I used a CRX HF transmission. Economy tuners are becoming more and more popular. I figure that I can start planning now for an engine swap when my warranty runs out.
#9
https://www.fitfreak.net/pp-classifi....php?product=8
i would think it would be a direct bolt seeing how both are l series
i would think it would be a direct bolt seeing how both are l series
#11
Originally Posted by dacalac
what are the smog laws in Utah? Because any engine swap would be legal here in Cali.
The laws are definately not as strict as CA, but there are restrictions to engine swaps.
Of course this is assuming the smog technician is quick enough to catch it.
#12
Most of the rest of the world have the 1.33 litre Dsi engine in their Jazzes and Fits. In the UK it is called 1.4litre but aint.
The US is one of the few markets that has the 1.5litre engine (I think Australia may have both?). Most of the rest of the world use the CVT auto gearbox as well, which is more economical - but strange to drive until you get used to it.
The US is one of the few markets that has the 1.5litre engine (I think Australia may have both?). Most of the rest of the world use the CVT auto gearbox as well, which is more economical - but strange to drive until you get used to it.
#13
Is there a reason why the i-DSI is more fuel efficient than the VTEC available in the US, besides the change in displacement? I know the DSI has dual spark plugs, but thats all I know.
I think if your goal was fuel economy, why not get a CRX HF? Or if youre dead-set on a fit, why limit yourself to engine? Get some low-rolling resistance wheels from an insight. Also, put some cladding underneath the car to reduce drag. On the previous generation Civc, make sure and look at the grill. The grill on the Hybrid Civic is much more aerodynamic than on the regular Civic. Its really neat.
See the difference?
I think if your goal was fuel economy, why not get a CRX HF? Or if youre dead-set on a fit, why limit yourself to engine? Get some low-rolling resistance wheels from an insight. Also, put some cladding underneath the car to reduce drag. On the previous generation Civc, make sure and look at the grill. The grill on the Hybrid Civic is much more aerodynamic than on the regular Civic. Its really neat.
See the difference?
Last edited by mexellent; 09-22-2006 at 11:16 AM.
#14
Originally Posted by mexellent
Is there a reason why the i-DSI is more fuel efficient than the VTEC available in the US, besides the change in displacement? I know the DSI has dual spark plugs, but thats all I know.
I think if your goal was fuel economy, why not get a CRX HF? Or if youre dead-set on a fit, why limit yourself to engine? Get some low-rolling resistance wheels from an insight. Also, put some cladding underneath the car to reduce drag. On the previous generation Civc, make sure and look at the grill. The grill on the Hybrid Civic is much more aerodynamic than on the regular Civic. Its really neat.
I think if your goal was fuel economy, why not get a CRX HF? Or if youre dead-set on a fit, why limit yourself to engine? Get some low-rolling resistance wheels from an insight. Also, put some cladding underneath the car to reduce drag. On the previous generation Civc, make sure and look at the grill. The grill on the Hybrid Civic is much more aerodynamic than on the regular Civic. Its really neat.
I don't want a CRX HF because: I've had a 1989 Civic LX for over a year now. I actually swapped in a d15z1 (engine from a Civic VX) with a CRX HF transmission. I have Civic VX wheels/rims as well. I do love the car, but we have a kid on the way and I'd rather have a car that doesnt' randomly stop working every few weeks. I already have a project car, my 1971 Honda n600. There is really no need for two major projects at once.
Besides, the Fit is cool!
I'm certain there are a few changes in the design between the i-DSI engine and the ivtec that account for the fuel economy differences. I'm not really able to find concrete numbers on the i-DSi though, so I need to keep searching. Perhaps I should email Honda? This type of swap would be done AFTER the warranty is up, so it could be years in teh making. Honda also might come out with a better L-series engine in the next few years that I'll want instead.
#15
#16
One big problem with the i-DSI engine:
No high end power.
If you've read that article from the Temple of VTEC Asia web site, the author of that article stated that while the i-DSI engine has good torque up to about mid-range revs, at higher revs the engine quickly runs out of "oomph." That's why the i-DSI engine works great for urban driving, but definitely not great for the type of freeway driving found here in the USA.
This is why I think the next-generation Fit for the USA market will likely use a new compact 1.5-liter I-4 engine with the same SOHC i-VTEC valvetrain used on the R18 engine on the Civic and possibly also incorporate direct fuel injection, too. Such an engine will probably have far better fuel efficiency than the current L15A VTEC engine but with more torque and more horsepower (my guess of as much as 122 bhp SAE 08/04 net is probably not far off the mark, given how Honda got 140 bhp from the R18 engine).
If you've read that article from the Temple of VTEC Asia web site, the author of that article stated that while the i-DSI engine has good torque up to about mid-range revs, at higher revs the engine quickly runs out of "oomph." That's why the i-DSI engine works great for urban driving, but definitely not great for the type of freeway driving found here in the USA.
This is why I think the next-generation Fit for the USA market will likely use a new compact 1.5-liter I-4 engine with the same SOHC i-VTEC valvetrain used on the R18 engine on the Civic and possibly also incorporate direct fuel injection, too. Such an engine will probably have far better fuel efficiency than the current L15A VTEC engine but with more torque and more horsepower (my guess of as much as 122 bhp SAE 08/04 net is probably not far off the mark, given how Honda got 140 bhp from the R18 engine).
#17
Originally Posted by mexellent
Is there a reason why the i-DSI is more fuel efficient than the VTEC available in the US, besides the change in displacement? I know the DSI has dual spark plugs, but thats all I know.
#18
Originally Posted by Mateo
I already have LRR tires and perhaps new rims planned, as well as some aero mods like a grille block or perhaps some more underbody streamlining.
The big problem I have is finding truthfull "resistance" reports on tires, not sure why this info is not available?
I will check out your fourm.
Thoughts?
#19
Originally Posted by MtViewGuy188
No high end power.
If you've read that article from the Temple of VTEC Asia web site, the author of that article stated that while the i-DSI engine has good torque up to about mid-range revs, at higher revs the engine quickly runs out of "oomph." That's why the i-DSI engine works great for urban driving, but definitely not great for the type of freeway driving found here in the USA.
If you've read that article from the Temple of VTEC Asia web site, the author of that article stated that while the i-DSI engine has good torque up to about mid-range revs, at higher revs the engine quickly runs out of "oomph." That's why the i-DSI engine works great for urban driving, but definitely not great for the type of freeway driving found here in the USA.
I RARELY go over 2500RPM, and when I do it's always on surface streets.