OEM Honda K20 Fit.. why not?
#21
01-29-2009, 10:20 AM
exactly what ray said. honda wanted to make something good on gas and fairly cheap being a NEW vehicle to compete with the cars being made by toyota and nissan.
as you can tell most companies are trying to make better eco cars with better MPG
as you can tell most companies are trying to make better eco cars with better MPG
#22
01-29-2009, 12:57 PM
It wouldn't be feasible. They would have to engineer new axles, front suspension, brake kit etc. The only thing I think should have been reconsidered would have been making the GE's engine bay larger. The whole car got bigger, except the engine bay! This way we could shove the K20 in it ourselves.
#23
01-29-2009, 01:27 PM
I think we are still lucky to be getting the Civic SI with the way honda is cancelling performance platforms lately.
#24
01-29-2009, 01:51 PM
Honda is a very conservative company, pulling out of F1, killing the s2k and nsx projects (temporarily) is evidence of that. once the economic crisis bottoms and starts getting better, i'm sure we'll see a more exciting Honda. right now they're in preservation mode, smart move. however, a k20 Fit will never happen - it doesn't make any sense to compete against your own product. just look at GM 
cars get bigger and heavier because that's what the majority of the market wants. more amenities, more safety, more cup holders, a button that will massage your balls and order a pizza... it's insane. people who want an engine, four wheels, steering wheel, and a clutch are a niche market; we usually buy an older model car and mod it to accommodate to what we want.
cars get bigger and heavier because that's what the majority of the market wants. more amenities, more safety, more cup holders, a button that will massage your balls and order a pizza... it's insane. people who want an engine, four wheels, steering wheel, and a clutch are a niche market; we usually buy an older model car and mod it to accommodate to what we want.
#25
01-29-2009, 02:02 PM
A $30K+ Fit would not sell well in the North American market. Honda is currently in business to please the masses... not enthusiasts like us who they feel are the minority.
#26
01-29-2009, 02:25 PM
This is my rant, feel free to attack it but the thought goes...
I don't know why Honda doesn't just go back the roots... Small reliable car with a nice fast engine, aka EK Civic Type R, DC2 Integra Type R, EG Civic SiR... or even the Del Sol Si !!.. it did come with a B16 you know.
Why is it that all the fast Hondas have to be expensive?? aka Civic Si.. I understand that the new Civic Si starts at around 22k, but with all the options (navi, truck straps, floor mats, whatever else is in that catalog) you can easily go beyond the 26k mark!!! or even an Accord V6 starts at 28k!!!… lets not even go there.
And not only that.. but both cars (Civic and Accord) have grow to such huge sizes that the road they sit on can barely hold their weight anymore (ok I went over board here)… I mean I have sat in 06 Civic and it has almost the same interior space & foot print as my old CB7 1991 Accord DX. I mean really come on why can’t they just make a car for the “Civic Nation” (as they call it) … A quick car with a few extras that just destroys the competition and be the Greastest FWD road car again, and sell it in the USA !!! none of that Civic Type RR sheet…
If I was Honda I would make a Fit with a K20 in it from the get go, 4 wheel disc brake, manual 6 speed, LSD, nice suspension set-up, and some extra badging. Call it a Fit Si.. or Fit Type R.. or a 10th Anniversary Fit (1st Fit was around in 2001).. I don't know!! or even market it as a limited edition Mugen.. all for about 20k !!... I mean really the K20 will pass current emissions, with the suspension they have so many engineers working for them they can update the current GE8 Fit to not understeer incredibly within a week. In fact they could grab a couple suspension engineers from the Formula One team and make A Great Handling FWD Car come back to life.. Call it a return to the USDM DC2 Type R.. Small, Quick, and proves a point!!.. Honda can make the best FWD car out there!!
I mean they could market it against the Mazdaspeed 3, Cobalt SS turbo, Caliber SRT-4… hell even The Mini Cooper S (although not in interior quality J )… But if they could shoehorn say a 09’s Civic Si’s K20 and tranny, brakes from a new 09’ Acura TSX, reinforce the body, tune the suspension, paint it some unique (tasteful) colors… I say we got a winner!!!
What do you think???
I don't know why Honda doesn't just go back the roots... Small reliable car with a nice fast engine, aka EK Civic Type R, DC2 Integra Type R, EG Civic SiR... or even the Del Sol Si !!.. it did come with a B16 you know.
Why is it that all the fast Hondas have to be expensive?? aka Civic Si.. I understand that the new Civic Si starts at around 22k, but with all the options (navi, truck straps, floor mats, whatever else is in that catalog) you can easily go beyond the 26k mark!!! or even an Accord V6 starts at 28k!!!… lets not even go there.
And not only that.. but both cars (Civic and Accord) have grow to such huge sizes that the road they sit on can barely hold their weight anymore (ok I went over board here)… I mean I have sat in 06 Civic and it has almost the same interior space & foot print as my old CB7 1991 Accord DX. I mean really come on why can’t they just make a car for the “Civic Nation” (as they call it) … A quick car with a few extras that just destroys the competition and be the Greastest FWD road car again, and sell it in the USA !!! none of that Civic Type RR sheet…
If I was Honda I would make a Fit with a K20 in it from the get go, 4 wheel disc brake, manual 6 speed, LSD, nice suspension set-up, and some extra badging. Call it a Fit Si.. or Fit Type R.. or a 10th Anniversary Fit (1st Fit was around in 2001).. I don't know!! or even market it as a limited edition Mugen.. all for about 20k !!... I mean really the K20 will pass current emissions, with the suspension they have so many engineers working for them they can update the current GE8 Fit to not understeer incredibly within a week. In fact they could grab a couple suspension engineers from the Formula One team and make A Great Handling FWD Car come back to life.. Call it a return to the USDM DC2 Type R.. Small, Quick, and proves a point!!.. Honda can make the best FWD car out there!!
I mean they could market it against the Mazdaspeed 3, Cobalt SS turbo, Caliber SRT-4… hell even The Mini Cooper S (although not in interior quality J )… But if they could shoehorn say a 09’s Civic Si’s K20 and tranny, brakes from a new 09’ Acura TSX, reinforce the body, tune the suspension, paint it some unique (tasteful) colors… I say we got a winner!!!
What do you think???
your idea is not totally dumb though. a fit si would be awesome, but a k20 fit is a bit ridiculous.
think about it: a fit weighs in at about what older civic did, did they NEED 2.0 litre DOHC engines with 8k rev-limits? no.
a 1.8 litre would be the biggest necessary. maybe a high output version of what the civic has now.
and the brakes from the acura tsx are only awesome on anything BUT the tsx, because rumor is they suck ON the tsx.
the usdm dc2 was awesome...and it only sold to hardcore hondaphiles. not exactly good for buisness as they lost money on every single one.
you want to know why the civic is so big? because so is the competition. don't hang honda out to dry when they are only following the current automotive trends. A lot of cars were smaller back then too you know.
and then there is this little thing called safety. the mazdaspeed3, the GTI, the cobalt ss, the sentra se-r, the wrx, the lancer ralliart, the mini, they can all get you going quickly but they do it safely. honda has to be able to do the same.
and the only way they are going to 'destroy' the competition is by keeping weight down (relatively) and increasing engine displacement so that their sport compacts remain naturally aspirated and retain that 'honda-ness'.
so here are your answers.
1. the next si needs to stay the same weight-wise, but engine displacement needs to increase to at least 2.2 litres while maintaining the current si's almost 100hp per litre.
2. introduce a fit si with a bigger, more powerful engine, discs all around, better, bigger tires, and more aggressive suspension tuning.
voila!
Last edited by eldaino; 01-29-2009 at 02:34 PM.
#27
01-29-2009, 02:46 PM
Just get an older chassis (eg, ek, ej, eh, dc2, crx, del sol, even the ep3) and a good running K motor and you got yourself a low 13 seconds car. The swap is being done more common than you think.
#28
01-29-2009, 03:15 PM
great advice. an ek would be perfect.
#29
01-29-2009, 03:34 PM
) or the nissan POS that i dont even know the name anymore because it was the worst car i ever drove. It wouldn't be feasible. They would have to engineer new axles, front suspension, brake kit etc. The only thing I think should have been reconsidered would have been making the GE's engine bay larger. The whole car got bigger, except the engine bay! This way we could shove the K20 in it ourselves.
not to address the K20 idea it wouldnt happen unless it was RWD and then it would maybe fit and then you still have to cut up the bottom of the car up and the firewall but guess what you still would have craptastic wieght distibution sense the engine would be mounted in the center of the front wheels. i could see someone do the swap and have alot of troubles doing it and then all you can say is that you have it and there i nothing good about it. sorry man but not possible.
also the V6 j series engines have almost no aftermarket so i wouldnt be comparing them to the 4 banger engines at all. they'er only more powerful because of displacement.
you want more power out of your fit stroke it out and slap a turbo on it might be able to get it to a 1.8L+ depending on the specs
Last edited by shonda1989; 01-29-2009 at 03:37 PM.
#31
01-30-2009, 08:52 PM
I'm glad the Fit was made the way it is and with the L15 engine.
It is whats left of the "sub compact" and isn't as "compact" as the class once was. Don't forget the Fit is a shitbox, hatchback, econo box a nice one at that but it is NOT a sports car. At least it isn't insured as one.
The Civic has moved up in class a few years ago and the Fit replaces it filling
the spot at the bottom of the line for Honda.
Take a look at the Corolla, its as nice as the Camry always was.
It is whats left of the "sub compact" and isn't as "compact" as the class once was. Don't forget the Fit is a shitbox, hatchback, econo box a nice one at that but it is NOT a sports car. At least it isn't insured as one.
The Civic has moved up in class a few years ago and the Fit replaces it filling
the spot at the bottom of the line for Honda.
Take a look at the Corolla, its as nice as the Camry always was.
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