Paddle shifters
#81
09-05-2008 | 09:52 PM
Member
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 75
From: CT
Thanks man from what I can see from the pics that the paddles might have some sort of relay or switch built in behind the plastic cover but I cant be sure until I either A see a wiring diagram or B at least see how it disassembles from the paddles, but im sure if I could see how they come apart and how it works a little better I could come up with something, I going to do a little researc on some switches and buttons and which ones work better in certain situations once I figure out the ones that work like the stock ones then I can start to come up a place to mount them. I actuall want to get the stick shift to a old arcade driving game and try to see if I could make the stick control the shifts. Does any body know where I can get some arcade parts from?????
anyhow, i think it would be really nice for autocross and hill carving to have a mini stick shift that just took over for the paddles... push up for gear up, back for gear down. shouldn't be too hard, the paddles are probably just momentary contact switches that either connect and send signal, or break signal between two points. question is, is each paddle referenced to ground, or to another contact?
there are a bunch of large, pseudo-stick shift momentary switches (center off, tap forawrd or reverse to make contacts) that can be used. if anyone is really interested, we can figure this out.
#84
09-07-2008 | 03:52 PM
Member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 85
From: Kenton, Ohio
I have a Sport AT and haven't tried out the paddles yet, I'm wondering exactly what are the benefits? I don't live in the mountains or anything like that I do mostly highway driving but I'm also wondering how do they affect your mpg? I'm guessing they just make your ride a little more fun, getting to hear the engine rev when you downshift past others, am I right?
#88
09-17-2008 | 03:37 AM
Member
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 549
From: Dublin, CA., USA
It is not worth the hassle of modification because of torque converter and engine that just does not make that much power.
With that said if you understand limitations, you can also get some advantages of the pedals over a manual tranny.
During our Mt.Hamilton meet, Bernardio driving a manual with progress springs & RSB, exaust,..... could not keep up with me in my AT with Eibach Pro's alone! He is a very good driver too, tracking his EVO!
What I did was sit sideways in the seat slightly and drive it Grand Turismo style! I braked with my left foot and kept my right foot on the throttle at all times never letting revs drop below 3K rpms! I rocketed out of corners so well that lack of rear sway bar did not even hinder me that much. Not that I could not benefited even more if I had RSB! I am sure that he could be right with me or even leave me on a downhill run because of the benefit of his sway bar. On flat ground or up hill, left braking is the king!
Disclaimer: DO NOT LEFT FOOT BRAKE ON PUBLIC ROADS UNTIL YOU PRACTICE IT AND GET A FEEL FOR IT IN YOUR LEFT FOOT! YOU CAN STOP TOO EARLY OR TOO LATE AND CAUSE AN ACCIDENT!
FIND A PARKING LOT AND PRACTICE!
BTW: I took the steering wheel apart and disassembled pedals. They are using micro switches and run wires to the steering wheel column and further below the dash to the fuse box. I have pics somewhere if you are interested. I even molded a second set of pedals and worked on larger and longer version of them for ease of shifting on a twisty roads. I gave up on them since I got good with OEM set up.
Ivan
With that said if you understand limitations, you can also get some advantages of the pedals over a manual tranny.
During our Mt.Hamilton meet, Bernardio driving a manual with progress springs & RSB, exaust,..... could not keep up with me in my AT with Eibach Pro's alone! He is a very good driver too, tracking his EVO!
What I did was sit sideways in the seat slightly and drive it Grand Turismo style! I braked with my left foot and kept my right foot on the throttle at all times never letting revs drop below 3K rpms! I rocketed out of corners so well that lack of rear sway bar did not even hinder me that much. Not that I could not benefited even more if I had RSB! I am sure that he could be right with me or even leave me on a downhill run because of the benefit of his sway bar. On flat ground or up hill, left braking is the king!
Disclaimer: DO NOT LEFT FOOT BRAKE ON PUBLIC ROADS UNTIL YOU PRACTICE IT AND GET A FEEL FOR IT IN YOUR LEFT FOOT! YOU CAN STOP TOO EARLY OR TOO LATE AND CAUSE AN ACCIDENT!
FIND A PARKING LOT AND PRACTICE!
BTW: I took the steering wheel apart and disassembled pedals. They are using micro switches and run wires to the steering wheel column and further below the dash to the fuse box. I have pics somewhere if you are interested. I even molded a second set of pedals and worked on larger and longer version of them for ease of shifting on a twisty roads. I gave up on them since I got good with OEM set up.
Ivan
Last edited by ciburri; 09-17-2008 at 03:41 AM.
#90
11-07-2008 | 02:01 PM
Member
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 166
From: Phoenix
I haven't read all the comments in this thread, sorry if I repeat anything already covered...
I've had my Fit Auto for a couple of weeks now. I've had a number of sports cars with manual boxes, and currently also have a 914, an E36 M3, and a Boxster with Tiptronic. I've also taken the cars on the track quite a bit in BMWCCA and PCA DE events.
It's interesting to contrast the Fit Auto paddles to my Boxster's Tiptronic. Tiptronic has a number of shift profiles that the ECU selects, depending on the driving inputs that it's monitoring (including throttle angle and changes, yaw rate, braking, steering angle, etc.). You can toggle between "D", where Tip is fully automatic, and "M", where shifting is controlled by two identical "+/-" toggles on the front of the steering wheel (thumb actuated). In "D", Tip starts from a stop in 2nd gear, unless you depress "-" to move it to 1st before starting. You can shift at any time in "D", after 6 seconds, it reverts to automatic mode. In "M", it won't shift on its own until you hit the rev limiter, where it will automatically upshift (very nice for full-throttle accelerations). In "M" it will also automatically downshift to 2nd when you come to a stop. In "D" you can get Tip to do a 2 gear downshift simply by quickly opening the throttle, which for some reason, shifts much faster than any other method (I've used this a lot). Tip also does reasonably good automatic downshifting and using engine braking under hard braking, especially if you're driving hard and Tip is in "sport" mode. It also will hold a gear in turns under hard cornering forces.
I find that paddle shifting on the Fit is actually more responsive than my Tiptronic. Up and downshifts are definitely faster. I also really like how the Fit upshift paddle has ridges on the backside of it to distinguish it from the downshift paddle, so you don't get confused when shifting while doing tight turns. I also vastly prefer the paddles to the Tip's buttons, which are very hard to actuate when your hands are crossed up more than 90 deg. when doing sharp turns. I wish there was a way to get the Fit to revert to automatic mode in "S" without having to toggle the lever from "S" to "D" and back. I doubt the Fit needs the adaptive programs that Tip provides, as there's just a lot less engine power to work with. I really wish the Fit would upshift automatically at the rev limit in "S" in manual mode, but I assume you can do the equivalent simply by doing a full throttle acceleration in "D" (haven't done this yet, just got out of break-in).
Overall, the Fit's paddles are really cool for a manumatic box. Sure, the coolest would be to have a true automatic manual, with servo-controlled clutch and manual gearbox, but at this cost point it's about as good as you can expect.
I've had my Fit Auto for a couple of weeks now. I've had a number of sports cars with manual boxes, and currently also have a 914, an E36 M3, and a Boxster with Tiptronic. I've also taken the cars on the track quite a bit in BMWCCA and PCA DE events.
It's interesting to contrast the Fit Auto paddles to my Boxster's Tiptronic. Tiptronic has a number of shift profiles that the ECU selects, depending on the driving inputs that it's monitoring (including throttle angle and changes, yaw rate, braking, steering angle, etc.). You can toggle between "D", where Tip is fully automatic, and "M", where shifting is controlled by two identical "+/-" toggles on the front of the steering wheel (thumb actuated). In "D", Tip starts from a stop in 2nd gear, unless you depress "-" to move it to 1st before starting. You can shift at any time in "D", after 6 seconds, it reverts to automatic mode. In "M", it won't shift on its own until you hit the rev limiter, where it will automatically upshift (very nice for full-throttle accelerations). In "M" it will also automatically downshift to 2nd when you come to a stop. In "D" you can get Tip to do a 2 gear downshift simply by quickly opening the throttle, which for some reason, shifts much faster than any other method (I've used this a lot). Tip also does reasonably good automatic downshifting and using engine braking under hard braking, especially if you're driving hard and Tip is in "sport" mode. It also will hold a gear in turns under hard cornering forces.
I find that paddle shifting on the Fit is actually more responsive than my Tiptronic. Up and downshifts are definitely faster. I also really like how the Fit upshift paddle has ridges on the backside of it to distinguish it from the downshift paddle, so you don't get confused when shifting while doing tight turns. I also vastly prefer the paddles to the Tip's buttons, which are very hard to actuate when your hands are crossed up more than 90 deg. when doing sharp turns. I wish there was a way to get the Fit to revert to automatic mode in "S" without having to toggle the lever from "S" to "D" and back. I doubt the Fit needs the adaptive programs that Tip provides, as there's just a lot less engine power to work with. I really wish the Fit would upshift automatically at the rev limit in "S" in manual mode, but I assume you can do the equivalent simply by doing a full throttle acceleration in "D" (haven't done this yet, just got out of break-in).
Overall, the Fit's paddles are really cool for a manumatic box. Sure, the coolest would be to have a true automatic manual, with servo-controlled clutch and manual gearbox, but at this cost point it's about as good as you can expect.
#91
11-29-2008 | 11:53 PM
too many to read (5 pages)
i read the first and last page of ths thread and i hope i don't piss anyone off if i have a similar comment -- i remember someone on another thread (and here) commenting on how in s mode, the trans should up shift automaticaly when the motor hits the rev limiter, well i have bounced off the limiter for a long time (when i was getting use to them) and it doesn't bother me one bit because honda put it there for a reason, it also made me get better at shiffting! let me give you an example - back in the day when sports photographers used to take action shots with a flash cube they had one flash and one chance to catch the action, so for the "professional" it was all about timing (they didn't have 20 picts a second, like now) and they got better at timing or they found different way to make a living.
so don't wish it shifted for you at redline just get better at it!! I DID
also the fit wasn't built around horsepower and paddle shifting, it's a drivers car for the average driver (IMO) i will go forced induction someday just because i can, and my fit will be EVEN more fun than it is now, the car isn't perfect, but neither am i! it's not like i walk on water all day just to step into my fit at the end of my workday and get pissed that honda didn't put more power or a higher rev limiter on my 1.5, i love honda and my fit, yeah they could do a few things different in my opinion, but i don't work for then (in that department anyway)
i drive other peoples auto's and HATE when i'm slowing to a stop and i grab their blinker to down shift to slow the car, therefor flashing the highbeams at car in front of me
i use the paddles all the time to slow and very rarely to accelerate - love love love them
so don't wish it shifted for you at redline just get better at it!! I DID
also the fit wasn't built around horsepower and paddle shifting, it's a drivers car for the average driver (IMO) i will go forced induction someday just because i can, and my fit will be EVEN more fun than it is now, the car isn't perfect, but neither am i! it's not like i walk on water all day just to step into my fit at the end of my workday and get pissed that honda didn't put more power or a higher rev limiter on my 1.5, i love honda and my fit, yeah they could do a few things different in my opinion, but i don't work for then (in that department anyway)
i drive other peoples auto's and HATE when i'm slowing to a stop and i grab their blinker to down shift to slow the car, therefor flashing the highbeams at car in front of me
i use the paddles all the time to slow and very rarely to accelerate - love love love them
#92
12-01-2008 | 06:41 AM
Thread Starter
|
spelng > me
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,382
From: Baltimore
[quote=
BTW: I took the steering wheel apart and disassembled pedals. They are using micro switches and run wires to the steering wheel column and further below the dash to the fuse box. I have pics somewhere if you are interested. I even molded a second set of pedals and worked on larger and longer version of them for ease of shifting on a twisty roads. I gave up on them since I got good with OEM set up.
Ivan[/quote]
I would really appreciate it cause I pretty much gave up on the project cause I couldnt any diagrams on the wiring or anything and nobody who has the auto sport on here has taking it apart or knew how it worked so if you could post the pics or pm me with them I would be greatful, BTW do you know what kinda micro switches are used
BTW: I took the steering wheel apart and disassembled pedals. They are using micro switches and run wires to the steering wheel column and further below the dash to the fuse box. I have pics somewhere if you are interested. I even molded a second set of pedals and worked on larger and longer version of them for ease of shifting on a twisty roads. I gave up on them since I got good with OEM set up.
Ivan[/quote]
I would really appreciate it cause I pretty much gave up on the project cause I couldnt any diagrams on the wiring or anything and nobody who has the auto sport on here has taking it apart or knew how it worked so if you could post the pics or pm me with them I would be greatful, BTW do you know what kinda micro switches are used
#93
12-01-2008 | 07:59 PM
Thread Starter
|
spelng > me
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,382
From: Baltimore
Or maybey a wiring schematic for the fit sport auto or something I really would like to do this project but I cant really find any info on this
Last edited by HONDAJUNKIE; 12-01-2008 at 08:03 PM. Reason: wrong post
#94
12-02-2008 | 01:35 AM
Member
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 549
From: Dublin, CA., USA
First of all vtecfit1, you are the man! I have a CRX in the garage in a slow process of gutting for track purposes only! Well maybe an occasional 2am canyon attack too!
Hondajunkie,
here is the link to an album I just threw quickly together from pics I took when I was messing with it:Picasa Web Albums - Ciburri - taking steeri...
Use slideshow option and scroll through it manually or just download entire album to your PC through the option on the album. One thing I did not picture is paper painters tape! I use it on silver (red in my case on the pictures) steering wheel trim around the airbag. Airbag tabs are very sharp metal and they can be easily scratched and steering wheel rim cut. Use rag to cover the steering wheel and painters tape over silver pieces to prevent scratches. Painter's paper tape can easily be removed without virtually any residue.
I would really appreciate it cause I pretty much gave up on the project cause I couldnt any diagrams on the wiring or anything and nobody who has the auto sport on here has taking it apart or knew how it worked so if you could post the pics or pm me with them I would be greatful, BTW do you know what kinda micro switches are used
here is the link to an album I just threw quickly together from pics I took when I was messing with it:Picasa Web Albums - Ciburri - taking steeri...
Use slideshow option and scroll through it manually or just download entire album to your PC through the option on the album. One thing I did not picture is paper painters tape! I use it on silver (red in my case on the pictures) steering wheel trim around the airbag. Airbag tabs are very sharp metal and they can be easily scratched and steering wheel rim cut. Use rag to cover the steering wheel and painters tape over silver pieces to prevent scratches. Painter's paper tape can easily be removed without virtually any residue.
#95
12-02-2008 | 11:37 AM
Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 168
From: Seymour, Connecticut, USA
ya, lol i thought it would be cool to get on the highway in S mode, lol
well if u havent been to CT, you dont know, but the merritt pkwy.
FOR SOME GENIUS REASON, (NOT) they put stop signs on the the ends of the on ramps, so you have to pull up, and wait for a long clearing, and then floor it up to HW speeds
well if u havent been to CT, you dont know, but the merritt pkwy.
FOR SOME GENIUS REASON, (NOT) they put stop signs on the the ends of the on ramps, so you have to pull up, and wait for a long clearing, and then floor it up to HW speeds
ct-15 FTL
i hate the parkway. dfghsdlf
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