Hey all, I'm a long-time Honda buyer and am thinking about a new 2016 Fit for my daughter to use for commuting to college. Never even considered a Fit before until recently stating to look for small car for her.

I'm confused about the discussions as to decoding the VIN when considering those manufactured in Japan vs Mexico. Why is everyone focused on first letter? Doesn't plant of assembly matter just as much? If I have a preference, I'm trying to avoid made in Mexico cars.

For example, local dealers here mostly have VINs similar the following:
JHMGK5H54GXxxxxxx

The JH shows Honda Japan as the manufacturer, but the 11th digit shows the assembly/plant as El Salto, Mexico (and not the Celaya Mexico plant).


But there are a very few VINs with local dealers that are similar to the following:
3HGGK5H9XGMxxxxxx

That decodes as being manufactured by Honda Mexico, but the location of the assembly/plant is Hamamatsu, Japan.

So, which is better (according to those preferring the Japanese made Fits), a Fit made by Honda Mexico but assembled in Hamamatsu Japan or a Fit made by Honda Japan but assembled in El Salto, Mexico.

(I realize some people don't think this matters at all, but I'm asking those who do think it matters and who are trying to make similar decisions.)

Isn't the first two letter codes just telling the corporate entity? That is, Honda has corporate subsidiaries in Mexico, US, Canada and elsewhere in addition to main Honda Japan, but assembly may be done elsewhere for economic reasons.

So, the two above are examples where the place of assembly/manufacture seems to be the opposite of the formal corporate entity listed as the manufacturer.

Can anyone shed light on this with some evidence? As to the two examples above, which one is "made" in Mexico?

 

There's no such thing as a Fit made in Japan by Honda de Mexico or a Fit made in Mexico by Honda Motor Co.

First three characters are WMI--world manufacturer identifier.

3HG — Honda de México S.A. de C.V. –* Honda, Passenger car
JHM — Honda Motor Co., Ltd. –* Honda, Passenger car

I'm not sure there is a good/current decoder publicly available for either 3HG or JHM plant codes. And that's the problem because 3HG and JHM can share these. So there can be a JHM…1… and a 3HG…1… without them referring to the same plant.

 

I'm still not following. Yes, I understand the first 3 digits as WMI. I'm asking about the 11th digit and what it actually means. Please forgive me if this is obvious to everyone else. In the example I cited above, JHMGK5H54GXxxxxxx, the 11th digit "X" refers to Mexico according to every source I've found. So, what does it mean that the WMI code is listed as Honda Japan as the manufacturer but the plant is listed as in Mexico according to the 11th digit?

And in the other cited VIN, 3HGGK5H9XGMxxxxxx, the 11th digit "M" refers to Hamamatsu Japan according to all the sources I've found, even though the manufacturer via the WMI is listed as Honda Mexico.

Dick, are you saying that with the JHM and 3HG vins that the 11th digit is being misreferenced by all the sources I've found for it? These sources are all just wrong?

And when you say that "there's no such ting as...a Fit made in Mexico by Honda Japan", are you sure? It seems to be common knowledge that many understand many of the Japanese built cars to be "assembled" in a different plant in a different country. That's what I was assuming the VIN I referenced above meant, that a specific car was Honda Japan manufactured as to parts but was "assembled" in Mexico. But I don't know.

So, what I'm asking is what this 11th digit really means.

By the way, I'm a tax attorney. It would make perfect sense to me from a corporate standpoint to have one corporate subsidiary be treated as the producer of the car, and yet have it assembled somewhere else, at least as to US taxation rules. Which corporate entity is treated as "earning" the revenue would impact taxation greatly. I'm not saying that is what is happening here. I'm just saying that it would not be entirely unexpected to me to find out that the WMI code often refers more to a corporate fiction than to the main place of production.

So, my question remains, "what does that 11th digit in the VINs really mean?"

 

What I'm saying is that I don't know why you assume "M" refers to Hamamatsu, Japan, when used in the context of a 3HG VIN. Yes, in a JHM VIN, that's what it means. In a 3HG VIN it means something else and what I'm telling you is that there are not good web sources that are comprehensive for all Honda plant locations across all Honda WMIs. We need, for each WMI, a set of the plant location codes within that WMI. It's not available on the web.

"M" in the 11th digit for a MMH WMI, Mitsubishi, Thailand, VIN doesn't mean Hamamatsu. Nor for 1FD (Ford). Honda de Mexico (3HG) and Honda Motor Ltd (JHM) are no different.

 

Every reference I've found says that the 11th digit is the plant code, and that use of it is mandatory in North America.

However, Honda seems to be playing fast and loose with this code. There isn't even a code for Celaya, with G being the code for El Salto which is 150 miles from Celaya. For that matter, Yorii doesn't have a code of its own either!

My new fit advertised that 15% of its parts come from Mexico, which probably means that NA- specific parts are still made in Mexico and shipped to Japan to be assembled. The engine and transmission are both Japanese.

 

Yes, I'm saying that there is no comprehensive source I've seen on the web for all plant locations Honda uses FOR EACH of their WMIs. Any list that doesn't specify a WMI followed by its specific plant codes is incomplete.

Tax rules may say it makes sense, but how VINs are assigned says it doesn't. The WMI is the company that final assembles the car and is responsible for the entire rest of the VIN.

 

Ok, thanks everybody for feedback. I guess the bottom line is that the various decoders that are available are just not correct (or uniformly correct) as to the 11th digit. I did just find a different decoder that did just contradict all the other decoders.

Dick, thanks for the feedback. I raised the entity issue because my understanding is that there are exceptions to the WMI coding. See for example this blog discussion.

 

And I'm confident as I can be that if you could see the door jamb sticker and the Monroney window sticker of every one of those 3HG Fits, you'll see Manufactured by Honda de Mexico, final assembly in Mexico. And for the JHM Fits, Manufactured by Honda Motor Co Ltd, and final assembly in Japan.

It's not important that we understand what plants a given WMI-holder encodes as which 11th digit--I don't even think they have an obligation to report how they do it to anybody. Just that they do it and know themselves what the characters mean.

 

I'm not sure that link is an example of exceptions to WMI coding so much as an indication of how corporate stuff works. I don't think there is any requirement that a WMI-holder makes all their cars in that country. One WMI-holder could make cars anywhere in the world and use plant code they invented accordingly. They just don't usually do it that way for all the tax and whatnot kind of reasons you are thinking of.

 

I would say incomplete rather than incorrect. As noted, any decode for the plant location digit 11 that omits the WMI is, by definition, incomplete since the plant locations can be repeated for different WMIs. It's OK to say a JHM … M plant code is Hamamatsu. It's incomplete to say a Honda …M… plant code is Hamamatsu since there are so many Honda WMIs.

 

Actually... the 11th character should be there an "X" for the Yorii factory in Japan or "M" for the Guanajuato factory in Mexico. This is straight from the Honda parts VIN decoder by the way.

Regardless of that, if say JHM then its made in Japan. If 3HG, made in Mexico... or even SH* (* Insert character) will be made in the UK and etc.

Basically whatever country those first 3 characters of the VIN correlate to then that is the location were the vehicle is fully assembled.

 

Yeah, just look on the sticker and on the VIN plate on the door jamb (or wherever they're hiding that plate that was traditionally on the driver's door somewhere).

 

Look for this on the window sticker . This came form an '16 LX w/ a C.V.T..

 

I work for an intermodal logistics company that moves most of the auto parts in North America.

I have anecdotal evidence at work that many of the parts that were used previously used for production in Celaya are now being shipped west to Asia.

A lot of the previous auto parts loads that we were shipping throughout Mexico with an end destination of Celaya is now being shipped northbound by rail to LA (Port of Long Beach) and are then sent to a transloader (they empty the containers and put the contents into another container). And the transloader is putting the loads into 20 foot international shipping containers.

Beyond that, we have no control of the shipment, but it only makes sense that if a domestic 53 foot container is being emptied in Long Beach and the contents put into a 20 foot international container, then its heading to Asia.

That would validate your suspicions of most of the parts still being made in North America/Mexico. Which makes sense... if the parts manufactures here are already producing the parts why switch to and retool a parts manufacturer in Asia.