I took driver's ed a long time ago. Back then, yellow meant caution, stop if you can without sending passengers through the windshield. And red meant unequivocally, STOP. In my area, people are getting bolder and bolder about accelerating into the intersection when the traffic light is red. Doing this used to be called "running a red light". Now it happens all the time.

 

Sounds about right.

Americans seem less concerned about their fellow man than ever before.

 

I see it all the time as well. Not as much as high speeds where it makes me fear for people's lives, but when the light changes a train of traffic will keep on going. Especially where I work.

I'm never in a big enough vehicle or always seem to have passengers with me where I wouldn't dare risking anyone else getting hurt but am tempted many times to just go. No death wish...not talking high speeds. It's really sad when you see people driving that way with passengers and children.

 

Here in Toronto we have automated red light cameras, which take a series of photos of the car and driver going through the red. Front photo takes the license plate and driver's face, rear photo takes the license plate and the red light. All photos are time stamped.

The $350 ticket is sent to the owner of the vehicle. There is almost no way to defend against this ticket, though many have tried. These photos are sent to the vehicle owner, along with the ticket, to prove that it did happen. Because there is no police involved there is no ticket to the driver.

Thus, we have a low rate of running reds here. More red light cameras will be added in 2016. It does happen, and it is very dangerous. We still have emergency vehicles getting hit as they go through reds. They are expected to stop and look both ways, but they still get hit.

 

We have traffic cams around the Pittsburgh area in some places but on the highways it's like NASCAR certain times of day. I'll follow the leader on my morning commute and can sustain speeds over 90mph for a good 5-8 mile stretch.

 

We had red light cameras in my town for a while, but they finally took them out when it became apparent that they were being used to generate revenue without regard for safety. It became apparent that there were not enough left turn and straight-through violations to pay both the camera company and the city so the emphasis turned to right turns made on red made without stopping fully. While technically illegal, rolling right turns aren't the hazard that the red light cameras were supposed to address. They did, however, generate the same fine as blowing straight through the light

The biggest red light camera company is mired in a scandal involving corruption and bribery in over a dozen states. Apparently, a lot of palm-greasing was involved in getting cites to worry about "red light safety." Our local city council has been remarkably silent about what perks they enjoyed during contract negotiations.

While people in other countries seem to be OK with computers acting as judge and jury, in the US there is a principle of being able to face one's accuser. A computer cannot be brought into court to testify and without an officer on the scene the cameras did not meet the standard for bringing charges. Cities tried to skirt this by calling the red light charge a "non-moving violation" like a parking ticket, but people figured out that tickets issued in this way have no legal force in many jurisdictions so the majority of the tickets were being ignored.

This is a case where the good guys won, at least for a while, and only after a lot of people were unjustly fined and harassed.

 

Really? The 'good guys' are the ones breaking the law (now matter what you think of the law it self)

'Running a red' (or whatever you want to call it) is foolish at best, lethal at worst.

'Running a red' should be an automatic fine, maybe points on the licence, and in extreme conditions a driving ban.

For those who disagree, try spending a night with a family who is at the bedside of a person who has been injured or killed by such a stupid manoeuvre.

 

The best way to improve safety at these intersections has been to increase the duration of the yellow light.

In our state the camera companies initially set the yellow duration unreasonably low. Previously, there was often a delay for the opposing green signal, to assure the intersection was clear. This delay was removed from many camera-controlled intersections.

Many drivers were ticketed when they remained in the intersection during right-hand turns, waiting for pedestrians in crosswalks.

Often, camera-controlled intersections showed a dramatic increase in rear-end accidents as drivers slammed on the brakes to avoid tickets.

 

We moved to the Middle West from an Atlanta, GA suburb about 14 years ago, and it had already gotten so bad there you automatically gave a slow 1-2-3 count before entering an intersection on your green. We see that here (in the larger town near where we live) every so often, but rarely in our smaller farm-community towns. I'm more likely to get caught behind a slow combine... and it's not uncommon to read of several ag/auto accidents every Autumn during harvest time because folks got impatient and tried to pass where they should have waited.

es

 

About a decade ago, some friends let us use their condo in St. Charles, a suburb of St. Louis. We had never been there before.

On the first day there, we're driving around downtown. Someone blows completely through a red light that had been red for quite some time. We both looked at each other and said something like "hope that never happens again." Less than 5 minutes later, same thing at a different intersection.

Then we notice the billboards: Can't remember the exact saying, but something to the effect of "blow through a red, you're dead."

Sorry, STL, nothing personal here (and loved your town, BTW), but we were aghast at the number of red light offenders, and we saw a bunch more. We drove reeeeaaally carefully the rest of the time we were there.

 

You failed to stop. That's a non-moving violation.

Time to break out the torches and pitchforks, I guess.

 

The problem is that automated ticketing wasn't being used to address the problem of cars blowing through an intersection. That was how it was marketed, but the ticket cam companies found pretty quickly that there weren't enough straight-through and left turn violations to make the cameras profitable. The first remedy was to shorten the duration of they yellows. There is no plausible safety reason to do this. People got used to the shorter yellows (at the expense of an increase in rear-end accidents) and revenues dropped again. It was at this point that the decision was made to concentrate on right turns on red without a dead stop. This is obviously not nearly as hazardous as "blowing through the light" but it did increase ticket revenue.

The bottom line is that, after several years of experience, statistics proved that the red light cameras were ineffective at reducing serious accidents.

Red light cameras were also an ethical nightmare. Essentially, the cities were hiring private "bounty hunters" and giving them a cut of the fines. Obviously, any corporation engaged in bounty hunting will aim to maximize their profits, which means that they will optimize their enforcement so that it yields the most citations with no regard for safety concerns.

The other side of the ethical issue is the fact that the red light companies weren't above wining and dining public officials and even resorting to outright bribes to land a contract. They got caught in Chicago and a few other places and I'll bet officials in dozens of other cities are fervently praying that removing the cameras will stop their own citizens from looking more deeply into the issue.

Mr. Onion, I'm sure that you've never been surprised by a "short yellow", never rolled through a right turn, and always stay scrupulously under the speed limit even when it suddenly decreases. If this is the case, you'd never worry about being victimized by a red light or speed camera. You also should fill out an application for sainthood and forward it to the Vatican.

The law, as established, was intended to be enforced by human beings who can tell the difference between harmless errors and dangerous acts. The law is corrupted by removing on-the-scene human judgment from the process.

 

Correct on all counts actually (although we do not have the 'right turn' law in the UK I do not 'roll' over Stop lines which sounds a similar situation)

As a member of The Institute of Advanced Motorists I pride myself on the ability to read the road ahead, observe signage and anticipate. In 40 years of driving I have never had any motoring ticket (not even parking fines) have no points on my licence, and never had an 'at fault' accident.

If you remember that a green light WILL turn red, there WILL be a speed camera around the next bend, and every other driver on the road IS an idiot then your driving manner will change, you will become a better and safer driver, and driving will be more enjoyable.

 

Also, the longer a traffic light has been green, the more likely it will be to turn red, so anticipate its change.

I don't know what the law regarding the light colours is in the US, but in the UK it is very clear.


Note that Green does not mean GO, and that Amber means STOP

 

Two years ago, I realized a light would turn red before I reached the intersection (long line of cars going through), and I stopped on the red. I was immediately hit from behind by a truck who figured I'd just run the red and he would too.


His insurance spent $2500 repairing my Harley-Davidson, but it's never going to be the same as before the accident. Fortunately, I wasn't hurt, but be careful out there.

 

 

OWCH! At least you were OK

When I get tailgated, I increase the gap between myself and the car infront. That means that I can slow slowly and hopefully the idiot will notice before the bump.

On a similar vein, I was approaching a set of lights in a queue and I was the head of the queue when they went to amber. I slowed and stopped easily before the stopline. I was literally open mouthed when the car behind swung around me and shot through the red light not caring about anyone approaching from the left or right, or any pedestrian on the road. If I had had a DashCam installed at that time i would have forwarded the footage to the police.

It was a totally brainless thing for that driver to do.

 

Don't be sorry. Drivers in STL are really bad about running red lights. Seems the cops have more pressing issues.

 

It's for reasons like this that I installed a dash cam. One never knows!

There's one town nearby that has a five-way intersection and the one who has the right of way is the one with the biggest balls.

 

Ah, that explains it. Everybody is perfect there because Big Brother is watching!

(George Orwell was, of course, British!)

The rules here in the wild west where we drive on the right side of the road are:

Red means stop if you haven't entered the intersection. If the light turns red after you enter it you may proceed and exit the intersection. If you are making a right turn you may do so after coming to a complete stop (some states do not allow right turns on red.)

Yellow gives warning that the light is about to turn red. You may proceed into the intersection as long as you do so before the light turns red. If you are beyond the hold line, as in waiting for oncoming traffic to clear for a left turn, you may proceed when the way is clear.

Green means that you may proceed into the intersection,

All of these are with the caveat that the intersection is safe to enter and that your exit from the intersection is not obstructed. If you can't get out of the intersection you may not go in.

The stated UK rule of yellow meaning stop leads to a paradox. What if the light turns yellow when you are 10 feet from the intersection at 30MPH? You're not going to stop in that 10 feet, which is why I doubt that the UK rules are markedly different from the US.

My experience in the US is that east coast folks tend to jump the green light while west coast folks tend to stretch the yellows. Each in itself isn't terribly hazardous if you are used to it, but take someone from one side of the country and put them on the other and the result isn't pretty!