The Fit's short gearing has inspired me to use an unconventional approach to acceleration: a 3-5 skip shift. It is somewhat awkward, but since the owner's manual recommends very high shift points (15 mph out of 1st, 27 mph out of second, 40 {!} mph out of third, etc.), it doesn't seem like an extra shift to 4th is necessary except to get to highway speeds. Not to mention the fewer shifts might reduce wear and tear on the transmission and the clutch. Even at 30 mph, I cruise in 5th without any noticeable lug, because I don't see any reason why I should cruise in 3rd up to 40 mph which is a waste of gas and power.

Just to give you an idea of my shifting approach, here is an example of my acceleration to 30, 35 or 40 mph:

1st to 2nd: 15 mph
2nd to 3rd: 25-27 mph (sometimes lower at 20-22 mph for casual acceleration)
3rd to 5th: 30-35 mph

My questions for the mechanically minded are as follows:

• Is this bad for the synchros/transmission?
  
• Is 30-40 mph too low for cruising in 5th?
  
• Is running at a higher gear really that beneficial to fuel economy, or are my mileage gains illusory?

 

Yes bad for transmission. Even Honda doesn't recommend it.
Yes 30mph is too slow for 5th.
No it's not that beneficial to fuel economy.

 

Why is fifth too low at 30 mph? At a cruise with little to no accelerator pressure, and on level ground with no gravitational struggle, it isn't bogging at 1500 RPMs (bog occurs at approx. 1200), so I don't see how there is any undue load being exerted on the gear.

Also as a point of curiosity, I'm wondering what gears other users cruise in at 30 or 40 mph. I presume 4th, but maybe y'all prefer 3rd?

 

I skip 4th and sometimes both 4th and 5th gears after winding up the revs on flat or on down hill inclines.. I double clutch when I do that to prevent damaging the synchronizers... If you are using more than very light throttle at low revs your ignition timing will be pulled back to prevent detonation and that will hurt your fuel mileage... Using a scan gauge to monitor the timing will teach you when you need to down shift... These little engines do like to be driven at pretty high revs though.

 

I usually run 4th up to 60 mph before going to 5th when entering onto the highway. From third to fifth would seem to make the car decrease in speed and need more throttle to catch up.

 

I like to run up to 65 in 2nd just because I can do it... You should be able to hit around 78MPH in third if you want to.. I got my first ticket in 27 years by doing that.. My car was still pretty much stock at the time.

 

30mph cruising = 4th gear.

Can you drive 30 in 5th? Yes.

However, here is my reasoning:
Anywhere that you're driving in a 30 mph zone is a 30 mph zone for a reason, be it pedestrian traffic, heavy traffic, downtown area, school zone, rough road etc. In these areas there is a greater chance that you may have to maneuver, accelerate, avoid. I'd rather not be lugging 5th gear if I have to do so and have to downshift.

Skipping gears in bad on the synchros, doing what coyote does and double clutching is the right thing to do, but unless you're used to doing that (i'm sure he is growing up in an era where this was common practice) it may be more trouble than it's worth to train yourself.

I used to skip gears myself on downshifts on hard breaking with rev matching but have read enough material convincing me it's a bad idea to stop doing it.

 

I can't recall ever dropping but a gear at a time when down shifting to slow down..My wife and I both slow way down by downshifting before lightly applying the brakes.

 

Not to slow down, no, neither have I.

 

Usually 2nd taking off (foot on clutch) in the left lane at a traffic light knowing I have to get into the right lane within 50 yards to get onto the highway and the guy in the right lane knows it.

 

I used to be a big fan of engine braking, but after giving it some more thought, the cost of the extra wear and tear on the tranny is not worth saving pads, which are cheaper to replace. I do leave it in gear as long as possible when slowing down and avoid up shifts when I know I have a stop coming up soon, but I don't downshift for braking unless I am making a turn.

Good call on the rev matching, Wanderer, but I don't have the heel and toe skill to do so while slowing down.

 

I do the same, just leave in gear until almost stopped and clutch in. I don't downshift and heel-toe to stoplights, i'll leave that to the tweenagers
This car barely engine brakes anyway.

 

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^+1

 

Educate me: How is skipping gears when upshifting hard on the synchros (assuming one lets the intermediate shaft in the transmission coast down to a reasonable speed)? And what good does double-clutching do on an upshift, particularly when the Fit's engine is so slow to drop off the throttle?

Skipping gears when downshifting is, of course, a different story. Double-clutching here makes a lot of sense and saves some wear on the synchros, particularly if you're shifting into the power band of the lower gear.

Engine braking at stoplights and such is rather superfluous, but it's a good idea on loooong steep hills...to the extent that the Fit's engine provides much braking. (Incidentally, the lack of engine braking even at relatively high RPMs should be a clue that running the engine at higher RPMs when driving isn't particularly inefficient; there's not a lot of friction to sap power.)

 

My legs are too long and feet too big to heel toe in a Fit but I probably couldn't anyway because the pedals have very little resistance... I was good at it when I was a kid and driving Austin Healeys that had long pedal throws and no power brake assist... I get over 120,000 miles out of a set of brake pads and haven't had to replace a clutch on anything I've owned that wasn't in need of a clutch before I got the car or motorcycle.. The same with transmissions... My Fit's clutch slips when I'm at full boost and revving high in the power band but that is due to the amount of power increase it has... It also will smoke the tires up to about 60 MPH in 2nd gear if the weather is cool and the tires aren't hot... The transmission is doing just fine... If you were to put some ultra light wheels and lighter than stock tires on your fit you'd find that it will slow down much faster when down shifting than it does with heavy wheels and the brakes, clutch, suspension and steering components will last much longer also...

 

Each syncro is designed to make up a specific rpm drop between gears, when you skip shift you're increasing this difference in speeds, which puts more wear and heat on that gear than it was designed for. The trans was designed to shift by the numbers and Honda has put out bulletins in the past to not do this. This is what I understand and who am I to argue with them. They designed it. If it saved that much gas don't you think they'd be taking advantage of that? It's not like they're gaining anything from warning not to skip shift.

From what I could tell from Coyote's post was that he's topping out 3rd and shifting to 5th, which would mean that the gear speeds are differing tremendously, double-clutching allows the shaft to catch up. This isn't a huge deal if you're putzing around shifting from 3-5 at 40mph, but shifting from 3-5 at 40mph also doesn't save you any gas, and will actually make you use more if you happen to have to accelerate for some reason as soon as you put it in 5th.

I would love to see that skipping gears does anything at all to improve fuel economy on the Fit. Maybe on a V8 with gobs of torque it's beneficial, but not on this car. It's just a useless practice with more harm than good.

And that's all folks.

 

Last post was stellar. I did test out my theory again with a brief test drive using my skip shift pattern and then using 4th. While one drive does not equal definitive data, 5th took down the instant mileage by a ton if the slightest bit of throttle was put in. 4th on the other hand could maintain speed efficiently while still holding steady in the 50-60 mpg range at a cruise. It isn't worth it to put extra wear and tear on the synchros to get an illusory mileage gain.

I would also like to stress the importance of double clutching, like the previous users here mentioned, if you make any more than a two gear change shift.

Thanks for all the helpful and knowledgeable input, guys.

 

While I dont skip-shift, im in 5th at about 40mph on level ground. When accelerating gently in traffic, im in 3rd by the time ive crossed the intersection. This is similar to how the automatic is programmed in the Tundra.

 

I go 1-2 at 10ish mph, 2-3 at 20, 3-4 at 40, 4-5 at 55 (or 65 depending on the speed limit)

Car struggles too much using 5th below 55 mph

 

I don't think I would skip shift any gear because I wouldn't want to lug this motor like that. This engine seems to love revs, not to say I race it out or anything but I really try to keep it above 2k. Seems like Honda designed it like that, I mean at 65 mph on the freeway you're pulling 3k rpms and the engine is so small it needs those higher rpms to move the car.