Why would anyone bother to remove an oil filter and then put it back on again? Dumping out the old oil doesn't clean the filter out. The oil circulates continuously thru it and the oil in it is already filtered. The garbage is in the filter material.

 

Well, the argument is really whether to change the filter with each oil change or leave it in place for 2 oil changes (as Honda recommends). No one recommends removing it, pouring out the oil and putting it back on. This could result in particulate contaminants re-entering the engine if they get on the clean side of the filter.

The main argument is if you don't change the filter you're leaving old oil and contaminants in your engine. But, changing the filter doesn't solve this problem. The Fit's engine holds 4.4 quarts of oil. A change with filter needs 3.8 quarts of oil to fill it back up. This means 0.6 quarts remains in the pan regardless. A dirty smelly half quart that can't be removed unless you drop the pan and maybe shake the Fit upside down.

And the filter only holds 0.2 quarts of oil.

The filter doesn't remove contaminants other than particles. These particles remain happily in the filter element. There aren't enough particles to plug it between 2 oil changes, or even reduce its performance.

Common sense dictates leaving it in place for up to 24,000 miles.

That said I'd feel funny telling the mechanic not to change it. The cost of oil and labor is twice the cost of the filter. But I might ask next time what the price of an oil change is without a filter change just to experience the rush.

 

also when i do my oil change, i rotate my tires also

 

"the results showed that the aged engine oils provide lower friction and much improved wear protection capability"

The Effect of Engine Oil Drain Interval on Valvetrain Friction and Wear

 

Synthetic oils break-in at 3000 miles. Why would anyone want to get an oil change at 3000-4000 miles when the oil is primed for lubricity? I change oil at 9000 miles for synthetic and 6000 miles for dino oil.

 

I heard that Honda engines are the best in the business when it comes to wear, for which they hardly do, which is the reason honda only requires a filter change on the B service, but most people (and Honda dealerships without consent) go ahead and change the filter on the A service.

 

A legit oil change should include oil + filter change. Its just too high of a risk in the long run to just change the oil while leaving the clogged up nasty oil filter untouched. what im trying to say is, slap on a new oil filter whenever you change your oil.

p.s. if you plan on doing it yourself, the first filter change is a bitch. the oil filter is on so tight, i had to destroy the filter to get it off.

 

When I bought my car, the dealer enrolled me (with my concent @ no extra charge/cost) a 10 year / 300,000 mile warranty on the motor from Quaker State, as long as I changed the oil every 4 months / 4,000 miles whichever comes first with Quaker State Oil. My first oil change was at 3260. Next oil change will be at about 6500 miles. I plan on following the guidelines of the warranty. I also got no problem from the dealer for getting my oil changed that soon, plus it was free, i had a cup of coffee, and got a complimentary car wash. Though the sticker they put in the window says next change @ 15% oil life.

 

I have found that trying to convince those people brainwashed on the 3,000 mile oil change interval to double or even triple it is a lost cause. These people use emotion rather than logic, as it makes them "feel better" to change every 3,000 miles rather than understand the properties of oil and how it lubricates the engine. I have always been a logical person and therefore don't resort to "feel good" type reasoning. Whenever someone says to me "but it makes me feel better," that's it, I'm done with the conversation regardless of what it's about.

With conventional dino oil I generally go 5,000 to 6,000 miles at a minimum. I just did my first oil change at 9,900 miles and the oil was black as tar, which to me has always signified it's time for a change. Before the days of Maintenance Minders you either went by the color of the oil, a set time interval, or oil analysis. However even regular dino oil is so good now that 10,000 mile oil change should be perfectly acceptable.

To the OP, I would never change my oil and reuse the same filter. I guess if you're doing a 3,000 mile change interval which you shouldn't be doing in the first place, you could reuse the same filter, but since I never change my oil that early the filter goes when the oil goes.

 

How do you know the filter is 'good' ? You can't without expensive lab equipment that measures the pressure drop across the filter and the flow rate with extensive data on prior testing including particle size distribution and chemicals filtered out and passing thru.
Change the filter.
Few filters will last more than 6000 miles before they offer little filtering as the pressure drop is so high that most oil bypasses the filter. The smaller the filter the quicker it happens.
Its far safer to change the filter and the oil. You can't be that much of a tightwad; that would be worse than Clark or me.

 

The 3000 mile interval is based on the old oils of more than a decade ago. Back in the fifties and sixties the oil would significantly break down and considerable wear resulted, Honda or not. And right it doesn't apply any more. But the 7500 mile interval is marketing, not engineering experience based.
Improved oils have extended that maximum to 5000 miles and 8000 miles depending on base stock (paraffin, napthenic, or synthetic), much improved additives (remember Pet Rocks Petrox). Not so much from particle size removal as from the quantity of 'stuuf' removed. The smaller the filter the easier it is to 'load up' with contaminants til the pressure required to get the oil to flow thru the filter at the necessary flow rate becomes difficultand much, if not most, of the oil bypasses the filter. Then you are merely recirculating 'dirty' oil which indeed increases wear by erosion as well as chemical attack. Its not like there is no lubrication but wear and tear is increased.
For synthetic oils there are plenty of long term tests up to 25,000 miles showing good lubrication but the filters were changed at much shorter intervals.
As far as reusing the filter once we did 'clean' the filterby backflowing gasoline thru the filter til the gas coming out was 'clear' and reused it on a old VW. seemed to work but too darn much work to be useful. Took a long time for the gas to come clean; as I remember it took at lest 5 gallons over 10 or 15 minutes. The first gallon was simply black.
Change the filter when you change the oil is a good rule. And don't wait too long to change the oil.

 

it was my impression that the Forum was to be used for productive purposes, not to degenerate into and insult forum to attack those who do not agree with your position. Change the oil whenever YOU want to. Others do not agree with you, and that is their option. Keep insults out of the Forum.

 

My first oil change on the factory fill was done at 7568 miles - maintenance minder was still at 30%. I changed expressly for the purpose of switching to synthetic, not because I was uncomfortable with the interval. I planned to go by the maintenance minder on synthetic now, but a beautiful 45-degree day on Saturday was perfect for an oil change/tire rotation afternoon, so I changed the oil at just shy of 10k miles since the last change (9939 miles - 17507 on the odometer, maintenance minder at 20%). I'll be sending a sample in to Blackstone Labs for an oil analysis, which is what I trust to tell me that the interval is safe - not the 3-month 3,000 mile nonsense hammered into the American psyche.

Mobil 1 and NAPA Gold (Wix) filters for me.

And yes, I plan on keeping this car until the wheels fall off. It should have 350k miles (or more) on it by the time it turns 10 at this rate

 

Alright here's me trying not to thread-jack, but I'll ask anyway.

Instead of Fram, what should I be using?

 

i just use the factory oil filter. been doing that for all my cars for many many years. no issue.

 

Yeah but productive purposes don't include unnecessarily lining the pockets of Jiffy Lube.

I'm still waiting for a single reference to a study showing any benefit from changing your oil sooner than called for by manufacturers. That would be productive.

 

The hell it isn't. You're saying Honda doesn't rely on engineers to test and specify maintenance intervals? You're saying no car manufacturer in the world does? You're saying independent studies (I've quoted several) supporting the efficacy of oil over the manufacturer's recommended intervals are marketing? By whom?

Think about it mahout. You're a smart guy. Or you change oil for a living.

 

Except in the case of the first oil change, the oil that comes in the car from the factory has additives that discolor it right from the start.

 

Honda does but you might be alarmed at Honda engineers who don't follow the7500 mile oill change and 15,000 milefilter changes. Most think 5000 miles is long enough for both. You might want to consider why 'severe service' intervals are given. Some of us think every day driving constitutes severe service.
For those of us who have access to dynomometers and engine teardowns we recognize that marketing often takes presidence over engineering. its the reason Dilbert is so popular with engneers.
Granted most of the teardowns and dyno tests are done on engines that see heavy duty service so the oil analyses are are more 'at the limits' of service. But a few have been on regular oil changes and the longer you run between oil/filter changes and the smaller the filter the worst the contamination.
And yes if you run too short an interval lubrication suffers. oil has to break-in too. to get the right viiscosity mix. An old story about Bunky Knudsen, who became GMpresident, was that his first project was to find out why the engines failing initial startup did so, a left-handed monkey wrench project. (way back new guys in the shop had to get an experienced mechanic a 'left-hand wrench so the job could be done right, offering much amusement to experienced mechanics)
Only in Bunky's case he found that almost all the failed engines occurred within 50 miles of the fresh oil fill. He also found that the viscosity of the oil had to be reduced by about 5Z% before the engine was well lubricated and that penetration of oil films betwwen close tolerance parts was essential. NASCAR troops found the same by running oil in their street cars for a few miles before putting in the race cars. More of old days stuff.
The real reason nowdays for reasonable oil/filter changes in contamination as much as oil shear strength reduction. Oil in order to lubricate engines must provide excellent shear strength, meaning when the oil is stretched out in thin films, as happens between two counter-rotating parts,must remain in a continuous sheet rather than separating into ribbons, thus allowing metal to metal contact. It most often doesn't result in ddisintegration of metal but does accelerate wear. And why oil analyses are carefully monitored for imetal content. The loss in shear strength is noticeable the longer you run, especially in high rpm engines.If you don;'t run over 4000 rpm it probably doesn't matter.
And, yes, sometimes I feel like I do change oil for a living.
PS the only long term testng reports I've read are those from Mobil where they tested mobil 1 for distances up to 25,000 miles but I tended to think their service conditions were a might tame. Like a lot of others I tend to 'err' on the side of 5000 mile intervals for synthetics and 3000 miles for napthenic based oils simply because, even using synthetics, its such cheap insurance..
Peace.

 

I've been using Hamp Synergy oil filters since 2003.