Don't Wanna Replace HU, Is Speaker Upgrade Worth It?
#21
08-25-2009, 02:05 PM
Well, I finally installed my new HU the other day. I had already put some Infinity Kappas in the rear doors when I was bored. Those with the stock HU were quite sad. The Kappas want 70 watts RMS, so the HU's 12 watts RMS (I think) hardly powered them. I put in a Pioneer DEH-P6100BT that runs 35 watts RMS, and during an hour long drive I destroyed the stock speakers in the front. The first thing I noticed is that the stock speakers have absolutely no high end at all. It's like listening to music through a sock.
While the stock HU is horrible, the stock speakers are hardly a step above. Putting a $150 unit in is very good and ten times better than the stock. Upgrading the speakers by spending maybe $60 per pair would make a world of difference. Have you seen the stock speakers? I think I have bigger magnets on my refrigerator.
Also, on a side note, I used the Schosche kit. The color is spot on, but the fitment is a tad off. It bugs me just a little, but it's certainly worth being able to actually HEAR my music! I'll be putting in my Alpine 4 channel amp under the passenger seat and my Alpine Mono block sub amp under the driver seat this week hopefully. Then I get to start teaching myself how to fiberglass!
Moral of the story: Upgrade your HU first, then your speakers. It's a must, there isn't much of an alternative.
While the stock HU is horrible, the stock speakers are hardly a step above. Putting a $150 unit in is very good and ten times better than the stock. Upgrading the speakers by spending maybe $60 per pair would make a world of difference. Have you seen the stock speakers? I think I have bigger magnets on my refrigerator.
Also, on a side note, I used the Schosche kit. The color is spot on, but the fitment is a tad off. It bugs me just a little, but it's certainly worth being able to actually HEAR my music! I'll be putting in my Alpine 4 channel amp under the passenger seat and my Alpine Mono block sub amp under the driver seat this week hopefully. Then I get to start teaching myself how to fiberglass!
Moral of the story: Upgrade your HU first, then your speakers. It's a must, there isn't much of an alternative.
#22
08-25-2009, 03:02 PM
Well I greatly appreciate everyone's comments and suggestions. I may end up going with the Pioneer AVH-P3100DVD at some point or something very similar. Plus, some decent upgrade for the front speakers.
I think my original concerns/fears around upgrading the HU all stem from the fact that I had a car broken into about 7 years ago and the HU, amp, and subs were stolen. I am convinced it's because they went car-to-car peering into the windows and looking for aftermarket HU's. (it was at a movie theater parking lot)
I just need to grow the balls to take the plunge and not worry about the past, and park in well-lit areas!
I think my original concerns/fears around upgrading the HU all stem from the fact that I had a car broken into about 7 years ago and the HU, amp, and subs were stolen. I am convinced it's because they went car-to-car peering into the windows and looking for aftermarket HU's. (it was at a movie theater parking lot)
I just need to grow the balls to take the plunge and not worry about the past, and park in well-lit areas!
One of the best things you can do is get an alarm that is 2-way. THese will page your remote when your alarm is going off. Some of them will even tell you what trigger was set. That's what I put in my car.
As far as what the RMS max is for the stock speakers, I wouldn't be able to say an exact number as I haven't tested the stock HU or the speakers. But just by judging the volume of my new HU compared to the stock and how well the stock speakers handled it, I'd say they'd handle a max of 15 watts RMS. But I listen to heavy metal and like my music loud, you're listening habits may be different. Regardless, upgrade those speakers too!
#23
08-25-2009, 04:15 PM
Theft was a big thing for me as well. I had my Civic stolen a few years ago (before it was totalled) and had everything from the interior taken. Very very frustrating. I refused to install anything into my Fit before I had my windows tinted and my alarm installed. And theft was one of the main reasons I didn't go with the Pioneer 3100. It just looks much more tempting in my opinion.
One of the best things you can do is get an alarm that is 2-way. THese will page your remote when your alarm is going off. Some of them will even tell you what trigger was set. That's what I put in my car.
As far as what the RMS max is for the stock speakers, I wouldn't be able to say an exact number as I haven't tested the stock HU or the speakers. But just by judging the volume of my new HU compared to the stock and how well the stock speakers handled it, I'd say they'd handle a max of 15 watts RMS. But I listen to heavy metal and like my music loud, you're listening habits may be different. Regardless, upgrade those speakers too!
One of the best things you can do is get an alarm that is 2-way. THese will page your remote when your alarm is going off. Some of them will even tell you what trigger was set. That's what I put in my car.
As far as what the RMS max is for the stock speakers, I wouldn't be able to say an exact number as I haven't tested the stock HU or the speakers. But just by judging the volume of my new HU compared to the stock and how well the stock speakers handled it, I'd say they'd handle a max of 15 watts RMS. But I listen to heavy metal and like my music loud, you're listening habits may be different. Regardless, upgrade those speakers too!
I'll most likely upgrade both at the same time.
#24
08-26-2009, 02:24 AM
Exactly. If you don't upgrade the stock speakers, just play it careful and don't crank it. I was intentionally pushing the limits to see what happens. I've already got my second pair of the Infinitys, I'm just waiting till I actually have a day off to put them in. I install car audio all day, so it's not always what I look forward to doing when I'm off!
#25
08-26-2009, 08:22 AM
Exactly. If you don't upgrade the stock speakers, just play it careful and don't crank it. I was intentionally pushing the limits to see what happens. I've already got my second pair of the Infinitys, I'm just waiting till I actually have a day off to put them in. I install car audio all day, so it's not always what I look forward to doing when I'm off!
#26
08-26-2009, 10:45 AM
My experience has been that all stock audio equipment in every car I have ever had has been crap... well my wife's 2004 Jeep GC Limited is by Infinity and is not too bad...
If I could have bought the Fit with a standard double din hole and no speakers and saved $500 I would have bought it that way in a heartbeat. I like the styling on the stock head unit, but it ends there. The sound is merely adequate.
Has anyone tried this:
JL Audio Stealthbox® Custom-fit fiberglass enclosure with 10" W3v3-4 subwoofer — Fits 2007-08 Honda Fit at Crutchfield.com
Its very pricey, but looks like a good option for installing a sub. I would be interested if anybody knows about any similar enclosures as well.
If I could have bought the Fit with a standard double din hole and no speakers and saved $500 I would have bought it that way in a heartbeat. I like the styling on the stock head unit, but it ends there. The sound is merely adequate.
Has anyone tried this:
JL Audio Stealthbox® Custom-fit fiberglass enclosure with 10" W3v3-4 subwoofer — Fits 2007-08 Honda Fit at Crutchfield.com
Its very pricey, but looks like a good option for installing a sub. I would be interested if anybody knows about any similar enclosures as well.
#28
08-26-2009, 01:32 PM
Also, for those of you upgrading your speakers....
Since, the front has seperate mounted tweeters, do you think it would be better to get a component system in the front or bypass the tweeters and get 2 or 3 ways to put in the doors?
I've always loved Kenwood speakers ever since I had the excelons in one of my older cars.
Since, the front has seperate mounted tweeters, do you think it would be better to get a component system in the front or bypass the tweeters and get 2 or 3 ways to put in the doors?
I've always loved Kenwood speakers ever since I had the excelons in one of my older cars.
#29
08-26-2009, 01:33 PM
I have always used Crutchfield as an incredible resource on product info, reviews, new gear, pics, etc.
Then if I've ever found something I want and trust, I find one for a cheaper price elsewhere.
To me it's kinda like Newegg (a great resource) although Newegg has been great on prices the last few years...
That custom sub enclosure would be something I would consider for my '09 if it was created some time down the road, but I would never spend that much money on it...maybe if it was powered with a sufficient amp built in.
Then if I've ever found something I want and trust, I find one for a cheaper price elsewhere.
To me it's kinda like Newegg (a great resource) although Newegg has been great on prices the last few years...
That custom sub enclosure would be something I would consider for my '09 if it was created some time down the road, but I would never spend that much money on it...maybe if it was powered with a sufficient amp built in.
#30
08-26-2009, 01:39 PM
Also, for those of you upgrading your speakers....
Since, the front has seperate mounted tweeters, do you think it would be better to get a component system in the front or bypass the tweeters and get 2 or 3 ways to put in the doors?
I've always loved Kenwood speakers ever since I had the excelons in one of my older cars.
Since, the front has seperate mounted tweeters, do you think it would be better to get a component system in the front or bypass the tweeters and get 2 or 3 ways to put in the doors?
I've always loved Kenwood speakers ever since I had the excelons in one of my older cars.
#31
08-26-2009, 01:53 PM
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#32
08-26-2009, 01:57 PM
Yeah, if you've got the tweeters in the doors certainly do a set of components. I have a Base GD3, so now tweeters. And I was not about to start cutting holes in my panels. Keep in mind though, that most component sets will want more power than a set of coaxials. So you'll certainly want to amplify the comps.
And please, don't ignore the rear doors. I've never understood why people do that. Yes, you're not sitting next to the rears as the driver, but they help to add volume and depth and fill the car with your music. Is that a bad thing?
As far as the stealth sub box, that thing is great. It's exactly what I'm planning on building for my car out of fiberglass after my system is actually IN my car and not sitting in my garage.
And I have heard some stock systems that are awesome. I had an Infinity G35 that I put an Alpine indash in (he had spent over $2000 on the indash) and a JL stealth box with a W6 and amp. It had a Bose system originally with 8 speakers and a factory sub. I integrated the Bose system and Bose sub with the Apline and JL gear, and that thing was one of the best systems I'd ever heard. Bose speakers, as well as Infinity, JBL and Kicker, that come stock in a car and actually VERY comparable to aftermarket gear. No like our speakers.
And please, don't ignore the rear doors. I've never understood why people do that. Yes, you're not sitting next to the rears as the driver, but they help to add volume and depth and fill the car with your music. Is that a bad thing?
As far as the stealth sub box, that thing is great. It's exactly what I'm planning on building for my car out of fiberglass after my system is actually IN my car and not sitting in my garage.
And I have heard some stock systems that are awesome. I had an Infinity G35 that I put an Alpine indash in (he had spent over $2000 on the indash) and a JL stealth box with a W6 and amp. It had a Bose system originally with 8 speakers and a factory sub. I integrated the Bose system and Bose sub with the Apline and JL gear, and that thing was one of the best systems I'd ever heard. Bose speakers, as well as Infinity, JBL and Kicker, that come stock in a car and actually VERY comparable to aftermarket gear. No like our speakers.
#33
08-26-2009, 02:14 PM
I tried to edit my last post, but it wouldn't let me add the pictures. So here they are. This is for those of us that haven't seen the stock speakers. I'm comparing them to the Infinity Kappa 62.9i that I'll put in, when I'm not lazy. Notice the magnet sizes.
Sorry for the crappy pictures, still a bit hung over. I swear they looked great when I was taking them! And yes, that little silver disc IS the magnet for the stock speaker.
Sorry for the crappy pictures, still a bit hung over. I swear they looked great when I was taking them! And yes, that little silver disc IS the magnet for the stock speaker.
#34
08-26-2009, 02:40 PM
I do like the design of the components but I hate trying to see if the tweeters will fit in there or not. I figure if I do a HU that does 200 watt, 25 RMS and hook that to an amp that puts out an additional 25 RMS, all I have to do is get (4) 6.5 inch speakers that take at least 50 RMS and the system should be loud as hell. When you think about the stock system only doing 14 RMS or so with those crappy speakers, then take something that does double, oh man, it will be awesome.
#35
08-27-2009, 03:19 AM
I don't know how well the component set's tweeters will fit in the GD3, but from looking it appears they'll pop in with a bit of cutting. I remember seeing pictures of the GE8's tweeters out of the dash and they seemed to be smaller than 1 inch. It certainly might be worth a try.
If you use an amp with the aftermarket headunit, you won't be using the HU's amp. You'll want to make sure to get a HU with at least 2 pairs of pre outs. These will run RCAs down to the amp. It's basically the non amplified version of the signal going into the amp. This increases both control and quality of the sound. Most amps that are four channel do around 50 to 75 watts RMS. Mine does 75 watts RMS, and there are plenty out there that do over 100, though that's a bit overkill for me. And expensive.
If you use an amp with the aftermarket headunit, you won't be using the HU's amp. You'll want to make sure to get a HU with at least 2 pairs of pre outs. These will run RCAs down to the amp. It's basically the non amplified version of the signal going into the amp. This increases both control and quality of the sound. Most amps that are four channel do around 50 to 75 watts RMS. Mine does 75 watts RMS, and there are plenty out there that do over 100, though that's a bit overkill for me. And expensive.
#36
08-27-2009, 10:14 PM
I meant an amp that handles an additional 25 on top of what the hu puts out. I would need a 4 channel amp correct, but would it be 2 or 4 ohms? I had just two ways in other cars and they sounded just as good as the separate mounted tweeters. I like treble a lot and when I upgraded my 89 lude I actually got not 1 but 2 music ordinance tickets. Funny thing is, is when I got pulled over the second time, the cop told me if I was listening to Metallica, he might have let me go. PIGS!
Last edited by Fitguy07; 08-27-2009 at 10:20 PM.
#37
08-27-2009, 10:24 PM
I do like the design of the components but I hate trying to see if the tweeters will fit in there or not. I figure if I do a HU that does 200 watt, 25 RMS and hook that to an amp that puts out an additional 25 RMS, all I have to do is get (4) 6.5 inch speakers that take at least 50 RMS and the system should be loud as hell. When you think about the stock system only doing 14 RMS or so with those crappy speakers, then take something that does double, oh man, it will be awesome.
#38
08-27-2009, 10:27 PM
1) From a volume side, the amount of volume an extra two speakers will add pales in comparison to if you use that money on a louder and stronger set of front speakers. Instead of spending $200 on four speakers, spend it on two and it'll sound just fine.
2) From a staging perspective, it'll sound much stranger to have your mids and highs coming from all sides instead of just right in front of you. Bass is non-directional, higher tones aren't. It sounds BETTER to only have sound coming from the front.
#39
08-28-2009, 08:59 AM
Because:
1) From a volume side, the amount of volume an extra two speakers will add pales in comparison to if you use that money on a louder and stronger set of front speakers. Instead of spending $200 on four speakers, spend it on two and it'll sound just fine.
2) From a staging perspective, it'll sound much stranger to have your mids and highs coming from all sides instead of just right in front of you. Bass is non-directional, higher tones aren't. It sounds BETTER to only have sound coming from the front.
1) From a volume side, the amount of volume an extra two speakers will add pales in comparison to if you use that money on a louder and stronger set of front speakers. Instead of spending $200 on four speakers, spend it on two and it'll sound just fine.
2) From a staging perspective, it'll sound much stranger to have your mids and highs coming from all sides instead of just right in front of you. Bass is non-directional, higher tones aren't. It sounds BETTER to only have sound coming from the front.
and remember, headunits arnt 25 watts rms.... they are 25 watts max with like 14 or so rms... so 50 watts rms is a huge difference.... and dont cheap out on the amp... sure it will be loud, but more power doesnt always mean better quallity
#40
08-28-2009, 10:11 AM
Because:
1) From a volume side, the amount of volume an extra two speakers will add pales in comparison to if you use that money on a louder and stronger set of front speakers. Instead of spending $200 on four speakers, spend it on two and it'll sound just fine.
2) From a staging perspective, it'll sound much stranger to have your mids and highs coming from all sides instead of just right in front of you. Bass is non-directional, higher tones aren't. It sounds BETTER to only have sound coming from the front.
1) From a volume side, the amount of volume an extra two speakers will add pales in comparison to if you use that money on a louder and stronger set of front speakers. Instead of spending $200 on four speakers, spend it on two and it'll sound just fine.
2) From a staging perspective, it'll sound much stranger to have your mids and highs coming from all sides instead of just right in front of you. Bass is non-directional, higher tones aren't. It sounds BETTER to only have sound coming from the front.
Last edited by Fitguy07; 08-28-2009 at 10:14 AM.